that's "hardball" for now. "countdown" with keith olbermann starts now. which of these stories will you be talking about tomorrow? cave-in. the word, official now, from the senate. no vote on bush tax cuts for the rich. no vote on obama tax cuts for the middle class. they are afraid of the topic. they are afraid of the fight. and the democrats in the house are afraid to go first. congressman larson of connecticut. >> the anxiety comes from what our colleagues across the building will do in the united states senate. >> my guest, michael moore, on what should have been a day of democratic triumph. and on the small lie. more on our report on tax breaks and small business, small in name only. on the republicans' remarkably flimsy plan, the pledge to america. a lemon of a pledge. >> we are not going to be any different than what we did.

>> we can provide certainty and relief if we would just extend the current tax rates now. >> nice slip, sparky. howard finemann and chris hays on giving the de-energized base an anvil. gold line and the gold finger. >> here's the deal. call gold line, study it out, pray on it. if it's the right thing for you, then do it. >> you better pray. at the gold line congressional hearing. >> once people have been convinceded by their fear and the lies to purchase these products, they are profoundly ripped off. >> our guest, congressman anthony wiener. all the news and commentary now on "countdown." >> the people that i trust are the people at the gold line. good evening from new york. on this program last night, we

revealed a list. that list is growing of massive, global well-known multibillion dollar companies whose owners benefit from so-called small business tax cuts republicans want to extend for the richest 2% of persons. president obama wants congressional democrats to take a stand so if republicans filibuster in the senate americans could see congressional democrats extending to extend just the middle tax cuts that benefit everybody but the rich. and also to see republicans holding those tax cuts hostage to extort the extension of the small business in name only tax cuts. this would also prevent republicans from campaigning on the slogan that democrats are letting taxes go up next year. it was a move widely seen as the democrats last real chance. poll after poll has shown voters in battle ground states would back the democrats. in our fifth story tonight, none of that will happen.

the spoerksperson for senator harry reid saying that the vote will take place after election day. that congressmen would rather return to their districts given on how they know voters already stand on taxes. president obama blamed the delay on the tax cut vote on republicans. a spokesperson saying, republicans in congress have made it clear they would rather stall and obstruct instead of giving american families the assistance they need. the american people would be reminded of that every day. it would be easier to remind the american people if they saw republicans every day stalling and obstructing. leader reid never brought it up for a vote. senator dianne feinstein telling the hill newspaper, quote, it should not be done before an election, it should be done after. how come, because voting for tax cuts that don't extend beyond

the first quarter million in income would be subject to tax manipulation. as if those below a quarter million is somehow immune to manipulation. and nancy pelosi wants to vote before election day, even if the senate does not. senator hoyer does not want the rest of the house to vote. others offered conflicting explanations. mr. clyburn suggesting some voters and possibly some members don't even understand the tax cuts. >> if you make $251,000 you get the same tax cut for the first $250,000 that everybody gets for that or less. the only thing you pay the increase is that $1,000, not the $251,000. i think one of the reasons there's been some recalcitrance

is that people have not made that clear. we're proposing the first $250,000 of all americans' income and applying the bush numbers -- apply to all income over that. >> there is enmimity in the caucus over what congressman clyburn just said. >> howard finemann has been tracking this story on the hill and trying to get a correct definition of the term "erstwhile." why did harry reid duck this fight with republicans and does that mean it's dead as well? >> i think it's dead.

as we said, i think they were going to flinch and they did. for congressman clyburn trying to explain at this late date that fundamental question, that fundamental, factual issue just shows you how poorly the democrats tried to explain this because they're afraid to talk taxes in toto, which is what they need to do. a lot of the benefits of the top rate destruction go to very, very wealthy people and to big corporations, as you've been reporting on the show. they haven't done it. because they haven't done it, they're afraid to take up the issue at all. >> it's 12 words. bush tax cuts for the rich and obama tax cuts for the little people. isn't that right? >> it's a reluctance to play offense and get involved in the tax issue because a lot of

moderate democrats, a lot of blue dogs in the house, a lot of candidates in red states, both in the house and the senate are afraid to talk taxes because they don't want to talk spending either. that's one reason. the other reason is i think the republicans are going to try to find in district after district some local small businessman who will go out and say, i'm being hurt by this. what the democrats need to do is find an average person in that district who will be hurt by the fact his tax cut is not going to be maintained. >> what do they say when the polling numbers that were given a week or two, the issue was a winner for them? and the s.e.c. union poll in the battle ground states and found 63% support for preventing republicans from extending those tax cuts above a quarter of a million. how do the democrats answer? they suddenly don't believe in polls. >> they don't have one answer. i was talking to senator bob casey of pennsylvania, who's a

moderate democrat. no flame thrower by any means. he's got joe sestac running for the senate. in pennsylvania, to take one example, it's a clear winner. casey was telling me he would prefer to have a vote. he's a moderate democrat. there aren't enough people in enough places willing to do that. and harry reid has got his own personal problems back in nevada. he's under siege and thought of as a great inside moving guy. he's running for re-election. he doesn't want to have to defend right now any tax vote. david axelrod, the political spin master inside the white house is now telling everybody, you know, don't worry. we'll have the issue because we can talk about what we're going to do after the election and what the republicansme want to after the election. if you're going to do something after the election that you can do now, why should anybody believe you're going to do it later. >> i took one government class that was a laboratory in

college. we knew political theater was two quarters of the game. take credit or announce you're going to attend the dedication. senator harkin said republicans won't let us do it? what about the political fall-out if republicans were on tv not letting democrats pass tax cuts for the middle class? >> i was in the hall talking to harkin about that. again, now, harkin is a liberal democrat who normally would be gung-ho to do this. but i was astonished by what he said, that the republicans won't let us do it. the democrats are in charge of the senate. if harry reid wanted to bring up the bill that would allow tax cuts to be kept for everybody under 250 and raise it on that incremental amount, harry reid could bring it up. the republicans would filibuster it. there would be a vote. that could happen if they wanted to do it. but there aren't enough democrats in the caucus of democrats in the senate who are willing to do it. and there's nothing more i can say. they are afraid to do it.

and they're afraid of the ads the republicans are going to run against them. >> howard finemann, as always, thanks for your time. let's turn to chris hayes, the washington editor of the nation magazine. when you were on last night talking about the political angle of the small business in name only tax cuts and we wanted you to come back now that the democrats have decided not to milwaukee make a fight of it, why do democrats expect voters to fight for them and what i won't fight for the voters? and why hand their supporters this anvil and say, here, hold this until after the election? >> i think it's an idiotic calculation. we should say we should be specific about this. i'm sure -- it looked like the house leadership -- clyburn and nancy pelosi and a lot of democrats did want to do this. i think the white house wanted to vote on this. this is a sort of subset of the democrats, the usual suspects of blue dogs who didn't want to do

this. we should be specific about who is essentially holding out against this. think what happened is in that caucus meeting. you had a critical mass of people who are in seats where they're imperilled. this was something that someone said to me, an aide to a democrat who has a stiff challenger. he said, we want to get out of here without taking any more votes. you know, it reminded me of the exact inverse in 2002 in the run-up to the iraq war, right? the republicans pressed their advantage and scheduled the authorization for the use of military force before the election. i remember democrats making the opposite argument then, which is that we have to take it off the table. we have to take the war off the table. the point is that you put things on the table to get elected. that's the way politics works. you give people things you are standing for. i think this defensive crouch is really mind boggling. >> we just want to get out of here without taking any more votes. >> if that's your attitude, they will get out of there without

taking and more votes in their lives. boehner said when pressed, he would cave and vote just for a big hunk of tax cuts for everybody else. if that was his only option. last night when we did the report on the small business owners that the republicans claim are left out of the obama tax cuts, they include multibillionaires, shouldn't even the most conservative democrat, the biggest blue dog love to have this ammunition. it's in the a question of they're a little tentative, they're throwing away some of the best material they've been handed in 40 years. >> right. in politics, right, you're looking for this diagram, which is things that are good policy, things that you believe in, right? and things that are popular. a lot of things don't fall in that middle intersection. we should raise energy. we should raise the price of energy a tremendous amount to forestall global warming. i don't understand not wanting to take a vote on that. but this is popular. what's perverse is they've

already taken a number of unpopular votes. every incumbent voted for a health care bill that is not popular right now. if you go back with the record you have now, why would you not want to take a record that would be popular and the last thing that registers in voters' minds such and the only explanation is they're scared of the 30-second ads. that no matter what the substance is, you're amazing 12 minutes, which i thought was fantastic, voters in some district, some marginal strict aren't going to see the 12 minutes about what small businesses are. they'll see a 30-second ad saying so-and-so voted to raise taxes. >> the list, you can do it in 30 seconds. use the 12 words i said before. bush tax cuts for the rich. obama tax cuts for the people. it isn't as applicacomplicated they're making it out to be. when senator feinstein the tax

cuts for those making over a quarter of a million, minutes later, there was this quote of the gop. vulnerable democrats can add the obama tax height to the long litany of job-killing policies they will be forced to defend between now and election day. paul lindsey, the guy who said that, he's right, isn't he? >> the most predictable thing in the world. that's what everyone has been saying, even those not given to hysterics. josh harris has been tearing his hair out on screen over the political malfeasance. absolutely. they'll manipulate it every way. plus you already have the record you have. you've already got high unemployment and bills that are likely not very popular in your district. that's not going away. so why do you want to pull back now, right? and go say, remember the health care bill that you don't like very much that everyone's talking about that's unpopular. let's just talk about that. let's not the talk about me fighting for tax relief for

middle class americans while they try to give tax breaks to the hedge fund people that got us into that mess. >> chris hayes of the nation, thank you. the republican say to the democrats, we'll see your cowardice and raise you some stupidity. the gop pledge today to the people of the united states. yes, we ran the country into the ground from 2001 into 2009. to quote john of orange, we're not going to be any different than we've been. michael moore ahead on "countdown." maybe you want to provide meals for the needy. or maybe you want to help when the unexpected happens. whatever you want to do, members project from american express can help you take the first step. vote, volunteer, or donate for the causes you believe in at membersproject.com. take charge of making a difference.

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michael moore on the small lie, the dishonesty of the term small business, the timidity of the democrats and this is the day health care reform started. the republicans sledge to merge, another bolt of truth telling. he admits republicans are not going to be different than we've been. two years ago, her campaign slammed somebody for calling him barack hussein bomb. guess what she just called him? and his gold line scam. the man behind him, congressman

anthony wiener joins us. grandma is the bestest. the total package. grandpa's cooooooooool. way cool. ♪ grandpa spoils me rotten. ♪ to know, know, know you ♪ is to love... some people call us frick and frack. we do finger painting. this is how grandpa and i roll. ♪ and i do [ pins fall ] grandma's my best friend. my best friend ever. my best friend ever. ♪ [ laughing ] [ boy laughs ] ♪ to know, know, know you after this we're gonna get ice cream. can we go get some ice cream? yeah. ♪ and i do ♪ and i do ♪ and i do

it has been 16 years since the contract with america was mythically and incorrectly credited with a republican takeover of the house. today the current gop leadership has unveiled its contract on america, although they're calling it pledge to america. or in our fourth story to simplify as republicans are wont to, lemon pledge. at the back of a lumber company, senator boehner, trumpeted the gop agenda. it's much longer than the contract with america and nogs say even less. mr. boehner in answering a

question on the gop standard of american values said the gop's unintentionally true sound bite of the day. >> on the point we make thth preamble to our pledge is that we are not going to be any different than what we've been. >> a bunch of white guys. indeed the rally outside that rally might not bode well for republicans. all two dozen participants chanting. the pages yellowing with indecision. they have the long-standing gop stats on smaller government. at the same time, it pretends to protect social security, medded care and medicaid. there is no detailed plan to reduce the deficit. the revolutionary part of the pledge is that it drew from the gop's listening post, the website, america speaking out, which i think is the name of this network before we chose msnbc.

where real americans got to vote on their favorite stuff. >> it's about listening to the american people. as we listen to the american people, these are the things they told us. >> oddly, america's second-most favorite thing was not included in the pledge. yesterday think progress asked republican congressman brady of the house ways and means committee -- >> the second-highest idea voted up by popular vote was to end tax breaks for companies that ship jobs overseas. do you expect something like that to be included with newt contract that's unveiled tomorrow? >> you know, i haven't -- can you tell me what that tax provision is? >> under further questioning, the congressman said that would not be in the pledge. >> we are not going to be request different than what we've been. >> then there is the gop mantra of repeal and replace. house republicans propose keeping seven of the most popular provisions of the

democrats's health care reform package. like a ban on denying coverage with those with pre-existing coverage. but it would rid americans of the means to pay for it. congressman cassidy said it best. >> you replace keeping the gt good stuff but putting it in a matrix which makes it more sustainable. >> the matrix. you take the blue pill and end up in your bed believing what you want to believe. by the way, if the republicans are willing to run on this stuff, when will congressional democrats start doing that? one of the authors of the pledge was a lobbyist until april of this year. according to the huffington post, sam stein represented corporate heavyweights like

exxonmobil. we'll leave the last words to eric cantor and john of orange. >> we can provide them certaintiy and relief to know taxes wouldn't go up if we could extend the current tax rates now. >> we are not going to be any different than what we've been. >> michael moore on this, on health care reform kicking in today and the ultimate misnomer, the small lie about small businesses next on "countdown." i remember being at the hospital thinking, "i should have done more to take care of myself." you should've. that's why i'm exercising more now. eating healthier. and i also trust my heart to lipitor. [ male announcer ] when diet and exercise are not enough, adding lipitor may help. lipitor is a cholesterol-lowering medication that is fda approved to reduce the risk of heart attack and stroke in patients who have heart disease or risk factors for heart disease. lipitor is backed by over 18 years of research. lipitor is not for everyone, including people with liver problems and women who are nursing, pregnant, or may become pregnant.

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september 23rd, 2010. this should have been a triumphant day for progressives and liberals in this country and

even have been one for those who those terms an anathema. despite lurches backward this country always moved forward for the most citizens possible. our third story, this is the day health care reform began to take effect. there could have been a ribbon cutting, a speech, a campaign event, an emboldened progress front with the beginning of the end of the strangle hold on this nation with the fraud that is the republican tax cuts like harris casinos in the chicago tribune or laughing at loud at the pledge to america with the defiant statement that democrats would be scheduling one vote in each chamber for the bush tax cuts for the rich and one vote in each chamber for the obama tax cuts for the people. instead, no ribbon cutting, no

speech, no calling bs on small business and no tax cut vote or votes until after the mid-terms. here with me as promised, the documentary of such films as "sicko" is michael moore. >> yeah, but don't buy it. >> too much merchandisizing? >> yeah. i refuse to go on these shows. if they hold up anything, i walk off. be careful. after that whole rundown you just gave, i mean, aren't we missing our thursday night comedies on nbc? >> all right. give them eighta minutes to go and look for their comments. >> where is the leadership? we need to buy some leaders somewhere. >> this is ridiculous. we look ridiculous. our side -- you know, i just -- don't you some nights just want to -- on a day like this and sit here and talk sports or just --

what more can you and i say about the idiots that are the captains of this ship? i mean, seriously. we are now watching what is going to happen in november happen. >> yeah, it just happened today. >> it actually happened today. >> that was it. >> i'm very willing to go back to the detroit tigers where the pitcher had a perfect game. >> just ignore these people. there are a progress caucus in the house that have 50 members. one of the members clearly stated what the tax cut, so-called, really means. there are nearly 30 members of the professional black caucus. you've got a number of people there who are leaders and speak out. why don't they get one-tenth of the attention that the tea party or the others receive? because if you go down there and are around them, they're very

eloquent and say incredible things. they've got it nailed down. one of them -- it just -- >> the answer to the question, i know it's rhetorical -- they don't have an agenda of fear and loathing and inspiring hatred of other groups. the professional black caucus is not saying beware of the black panthers or fill in the blank. this could kill you in your home. we'll tell you what it is after you vote for us. >> the only way to win on our side, we have to learn to instill this kind of fear in people? >> no. but don't you think that somebody could have been drawn from what the republicans did in the first decade of this century? the idea that occasionally you have to throw a punch. you cannot do four years of rope-a-dope and expect to be re-elected. you have to stand for something. as wrong as the republicans were, they sure stand for some things. they stand for the rich, against the poor, and in favor of wars because you can spend a lot of money during a war. >> right. there's something that's

attractive about that to many americans. >> because it's simple. >> it's simple. but it -- >> i know what you mean. it's eight words, i go back and live my life. >> most americans don't describe themselves as democrats or republicans. what they do like is someone who has the courage of their convictions. they'll vote with someone who they don't agree with everything they say because they'll vote for something and stand up for something and not do this namby-pamby. harry reid, i want to go down there tomorrow and tell him to drop and give me 20. this guy, absolutely no backbone. you look at him. it just -- it's so frustrating. the last time i was on here with you, i offered to to -- i can go down to the white house and sleep on a cot in the basement, a dollar a year, all i want. my escort will get a dollar a

year. but somebody has got to light a fire under these guys. i don't know what part they don't get. if they're afraid, like your earlier segment, they're afraid of the ads. they'll do ads against us. >> the bully beats you up whether you fight back or not. they'll run the ads whether you fight back or not. >> here's the lesson about the bully. the bully stops beating you up when you stand up to the bully. why? because you're too much work for the bully. the bully would rather go someplace elsewhere it's easier. >> let me ask you about the small businesses that are not. the speaker's office put out an e-mail on that story today and quoted the story we did last night, which is nice. i thought from a political point of view, that's a gift of 5,000 pounds of raw meat for even a

milquetoast democrat. >> nancy pelosi was thanking you for that. that was in such an incredible investigative piece what you did last night. it's like the next day, we're back to the same old and stand old and standing in the lumber yard with republicans about to nail everyone to the cross when they take over in november. >> we've even got the republicans saying they would like to take seven aspects of the health care reform, which starts today, which could have been this huge national holiday that we've got it started. and democrats are not campaigning on those seven points. it's like, we like these. we're going to keep them. democrats are not saying, you know, we wrote that. >> don't the democrats understand that as much as they're accused of being -- they're in with hollywood, that's actually sometimes a good thing? they could actually turn to some people in hollywood who would make ads for them and help them form the message? when you've got tom hanks and george clooney on your side and can't figure out on how you can

get the message out to the american people, it's just -- >> hanks, clooney, michael moore, we have to switch the radio now. >> their ads are going to defeat us. we better not -- okay, look. we've got six weeks left. how do we save the democrats from themselves such because if the republicans are taking over, the knife goes in even deeper at that point. i know people are saying, let the democrats get their ass beat a little bit here and that will make them wake up. i don't know what it's going to do. i think only the people watching this are going to have to say, we're going to have to do this. what do you do when the leader doesn't do it? you have to do it. everybody had one bad teacher in high school. and so if you wanted to do well in that class, you just had to sort of teach yourself. >> exactly. >> you want to get through you it and go to college. this is what we have to do in the next six weeks. but i feel bad for you. what do you do tomorrow on this

show? i mean, how do you keep up without -- >> i may read an entire james thurber book. it's friday. we can get away with a lot on friday. >> on nbc, we can watch "outsource." a comedy about sending thousands of jobs overseas. i think that's a genius idea. >> in hopes of it continuing this show until friday night, i'm going to continue this. >> there's a rule in broadcasting not to let me on live. tape in advance. >> they let me on live every night for 7 1/2 years. they haven't gotten me yet. you're not going to destroy me. tell me, john steinbeck award for commitment to democratic values. you're getting this? >> that's what i was informed. >> i'm astonished when i say this. >> i was astonished. i was informed of this. there you go, john steinbeck, nice, great thank you for the

people at the steinbeck center for this. and this wonderful steinbeck prize that i'll be receiving. >> it's a cup of water. but it's cold and there's a mice with a man brain attached to it. that's a bad pun. >> we are living in a modern day "grapes of wrath." sadly for so many of the people watching this who don't know if they're going to have a job next month or pay the mortgage this week. for the democrats to not understand who they're supposed to be fighting for. >> even if you lose the fight, the theater might get you re-elected. so what if you lose the fight, you fought for what was right. >> did you hear that? harry reid, are you listening? >> congratulations on the john steinbeck award and congratulations for coming in and not destroying the show. >> thank you very much. appreciate it. >> ever heard the story of goldie line and the three bear markets? congressman anthony wiener in his congressional hearings.

>> why is this politician laughing? because his speech is about spiced meat. when rachel joins you, kim bucks' shot at the veteran hospital. the gop's shot at health care for veterans. you never take an upgrade for granted. and you rent from national. because only national lets you choose any car in the aisle. and go. you can even take a full-size or above. and still pay the mid-size price. i deserve this. [ male announcer ] you do, business pro. you do. go national. go like a pro. [ male announcer ] you do, business pro. you do. i but i justve my 5 employcan't afford it.ance, i have diabetes. i didn't miss a premium payment for 10 years. and i'm worried if i lose my job, i won't be able to afford insurance. when i graduated from college, i lost my health insurance. the minute i got sick, i lost my insurance. not anymore. not anymore. not anymore. america's healthcare reforms change lives for the better.

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the republican congressman who called reconciliation undemocratic now promising if elected the gop will use reconciliation. first, the tweet of the day on the sanity break. less sanity, more break. from john mccain. honored to receive the guardian of small business award from the nfib. wait a minute, nfib? the trade group representing small businesses that haven't small at all is called nfib? paging dr. freud, stat! let's play "oddball." china, 12 lucky contestants have arrived to see who will become a panda ambassador. this is their version of "the apprentice" which features a former "countdown" intern. these 12 were selected from more

than 60,000 applicants and will spend the next week feeding and cleaning the animals. whoever wins will spend a full month tracking pandas in the wild. the ultimate goal is to spread panda awareness and then launch the spin-off, "who wants to marry a panda." finally to bern, switzerland. someone has a serious case of the giggles. it's the finance minister. he's reading a speech about the importing of spiced meat. [ speaking foreign language ] the minister claims he fun to the bureaucratic writing style in which the spiced meat bill was written was incredibly funny. i think he just realized he was speaking in german about spiced meat. time matches on.

worst persons and rand paul compares this country and this president to prehitler germany, then denies he's doing so and then does it again. [ male announcer ] one look can turn the everyday into romantic. ♪ an accidental touch can turn ordinary into something more. moments can change anytime -- just like that. and when they do men with erectile dysfunction can be more confident in their ability to be ready with cialis for daily use. cialis for daily use is a clinically proven, low-dose tablet you take every day, so you can be ready anytime the moment is right. tell your doctor about your medical condition and all medications, and ask if you're healthy enough for sexual activity. don't take cialis if you take nitrates for chest pain, as this may cause an unsafe drop in blood pressure. [ man ] don't drink alcohol in excess with cialis. side effects may include headache, upset stomach, delayed backache, or muscle ache.

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turns out the chief salesman for the chief sponsor for glenn berng hauled into court in the '90s by the s.e.c. on charges of defrauding elderly investors. a mark of quality. the congressional hearing into gold line next. but first time for tonight's "worst person in the world." you might recall when palin was introduced in 2008 by a florida sheriff who called the democratic presidential nominee barack hussein obama, a mccain spokesman said we do not condone this inappropriate rhetoric that voters will base their decisions on this in november. on fox last night, palin said we're learning more about christine o'donnell than anyone bothered to learn about barack hussein barack obama. please tell me she's going to release a statement condemning herself. rand paul, let a tea baggy

loose on history and they'll say the darnedest things. this is from his profile in gq magazine. in 1923 when they destroyed the currency, they elected hitler. that's not to mean that anybody around is hitler but it's to mean you don't want chaos in your country. we could have chaos, not just because of the democrats but because the democrats and republicans have all been spending us into oblivious and having a massive debt runs the risk of chaos. maybe not next week. i can't predict the stock market six months from now. but i think a country is in danger if it lives beyond its means. i don't even say that started with president obama. >> you're making a comparison to prehitler germany and saying there's nobody here like hitler. you're not invoking hitler of the '30s but you're not trying

to equate obama to hitler because there isn't that kind of problem. hitler was elected in 1933. our winner, congressman paul ryan, the young gun on the economy from wisconsin is not a fan of congressional reconciliation. when the democrats talked about using it in health care reform, he wrote "the washington post" that reconciliation is a, quote, convoluted congressional charade. the next day he called it an extraordinary and unprecedented abuse. never before has the house committee process been so gro grossly exploited. this is not good democracy and not good government. yesterday, guess what comes up, the cowedly and gross exploitation thing. >> congressman, can you use

reconciliation to chip away and gradually roll back some of the unpopular obama policies? will that be a good strategy? >> yes, you can. it's then a question of where jud works. the question is who controls the senate? reconciliation is the fastest path to get there. we want to use reconciliation. you have to use it to get this problem fixed. >> just remember, spell hipocracy with a y as in r-y-a-n. today's "worst person in the world." replant a forest?

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scare, lie, then rip off. the three-pronged sales

technique congressman anthony wiener says gold line uses to its customers. glenn beck and others were forced to answer for their practices today. you might call it the project to restore honor to gold ped dlars. according to court records, the s.e.c. alleged they used deceptive messages to defraud 115 mostly elderly investors out of $1.1 million over 18 months. the case was settled and the men conceded no guilty and returned the money. a former gold line employee saying two men are training other salespeople for gold line and handling their biggest clients. in today's hearing, the executive vice president confirming that the men once under investigation are employees in good standing at

his company. congressman wiener was interested in one scare tactic. glenn beck fearmongers in a web video for gold line. >> you see back in 1933, fdr said, we're going to take all your gold. gee, it's worth $8 an ounce. but some people got smart and they said, well, wait a minute. i've got antique coins. you can't melt these down. >> there's an identical radio ad done by either glenn beck in falsetto or some woman. gold line provides each customer with a copy of the 1933 presidential order, not so subtle subtext. obama is coming for your bullion. the message, buy antique gold coins from gold line. >> do you recognize this? >> yes. >> is this included in your packet of information that you sent to your customers? >> yes, it is. >> can you tell us why? >> because customers, when determining what products they want to buy, consider many features and benefits. one of the features and benefits

they consider is the prospect of confisication. >> there's a fear you my this type of thing again? >> yes. >> can i ask you, do you include anywhere in the material that this was overturned the following year? >> congressman, i don't know. >> the answer is you don't? >> our commissioned salespeople and our training is that if the executive order were reenacted as it were in '33 that collector coins were excluded from confisication? >> you take something from 1933 that was repealed in 1934, and then you extrapolate what would happen, fear, the fear it could happen in 2010? >> let's call in new york congressman anthony wiener, a member of the house subcommittee on commerce, trade and consumer protection. representative wiener, a pleasure as always. what did you achieve itted, do

you think? >> we revealed this business model is that they frighten people. these are people who want to figure out where to invest their money. these are come-ons. gold is going up. inflation is eating away at your money. buy gold. the problem is, as we heard from a witness today, they gouge you. once they suck you in, they sell you these coins. there's nothing scarce about them. the only value they have is a small amount of gold that's in there in case you want to melt it down. he was bragging when you buy swiss francs it's gone up in value. if the economy goes into the crapper in the future, i don't know how many people will take you were swiss franc coins. if you think about who's being targeted, these are people who have legitimate concerns about the economy but don't know how to go about purchasing for gold.

i don't know if gold is going to go up or down. but i know buying from this guy is really bad. as much as 180% mark-up on the melt value. you're never going to make that back. unfortunately, people are being exploited. >> one of the witnesses before you testified today he lost $60,000 in a day due to the transaction with gold line. how is that possible? >> he gave gold line about $140,000 and assumed he was getting $140,000 worth of gold back. but, in fact, he wasn't. he came back to them six months later and said, i want to take my money out of these coins. they said, we'll give you $80,000. that's what their mark-up is. they say this guy should have stayed in longer. he would have had to stay in 15 years before he caught up with the mark-up that gold line catches up to it. what was interesting about this witness is that he was a bright

guy. he had read things about it. a lot of people assume they're getting the going price for gold. with gold line, they have frankly are ripping people off. >> the scare, lie, rip-off scandal that you outlined if your opening remarks. is it any wonders gold line seeks and finds willing partners in glenn beck? >> this is where the angry radio host work hand in glove with these sellers. you know, you see glenn beck say, be careful. the economy's's mi a miss. you better invest in gold. it got so bad fox news said to glenn beck, you can't be a paid sponsor because the line was getting blurred. that's fox news' problem and glenn beck's problem. it's odd but i want to stand up for glenn beck's viewers in this case. but the laws that we're proposing obviously don't impact fox news and glenn beck can say and do whatever he wants.

but i would hope he looks at the testimony today and realize his viewers are middle class viewers who are struggling. >> speaking of middle class viewers and rthsothers. a quick reaction from the senate that the senate is not going to have a vote up or down on tax cuts on middle class or rich people until after the election? >> it should come as no surprise that the senate is where legislation goes to die. ben franklin called it the cooling saucer of our on democracy. it's like the meat locker nowadays. this is ultimately a very good day. you alluded to it earlier. one, health care took effect, closing the donut hole for seniors. the very same day, the republican party, the party that paul ryan says he wants to privatize social security and eliminate medicare. we have a clear case to make here. i just wish democrats would lean into that argument rather than being on our heels somuch. >> amen.